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Ben Bardon

CEO, National Australian Apprenticeships Association


i-exchange spoke to Ben Bardon, CEO of the National Australian Apprenticeships Association (NAAA) and Managing Director of consultancy firm Strategy 3.

Recently appointed to the Federal Government’s Vocational Education and Training (VET) Stakeholder committee to help drive reform, Ben is hopeful that new policy directions will see a reinvigoration of Australian Apprenticeships.

i-ex: Tell me a bit about your professional journey – how did you get to your current position?

Ben: I started out in the VET system delivering Adult Literacy programs for people in Regional NSW through TAFE NSW and Community Colleges.  I ended up running the Community College in Western NSW.

After this, I moved into the Group Training sector.  I ran a Group Training organisation for 10 years and employed more than 5000 Apprentices in the process.  This experience gave me a good grounding in Apprenticeships – what motivates employers to be involved in Apprenticeships and what motivates people to do them. Over the years I’ve also had a number of Board Roles and started my own consultancy business.  I took on the CEO role at NAAA two and a half years ago.

i-ex: What do you enjoy most about your role and what do you find most challenging?

Ben:  The Apprenticeships system in Australia is quite complex and there’s no single policy governing it. The Commonwealth has a significant role, but apprenticeships are also managed and funded through the various jurisdictions.  So it’s challenging, but always interesting dealing with this complexity and working to get the balance right.

One of the main challenges with Apprenticeships is determining the right mix of training and course types to suit the needs of the future workforce.  40% of people tend to be hands-on learners and are well suited to a work-based training experience.  It’s important to ensure that Apprenticeships are seen as a strong and viable alternative to university and other academic approaches to learning.  Australia has always had a more positive view of Apprenticeships and trades in general and it’s important that this is not lost.

it’s important that Apprenticeships are seen as a strong and viable alternative to university and other academic approaches to learning.

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i-ex: What are the most significant changes that you’ve witnessed during your career?

Ben: The introduction of competency-based training and the creation of contestable markets for training in the VET sector.

But overall, I’d say the decline in funding and support for Vocational Education and Training has been the biggest change. When I started, young people had a clear idea that if you left school after Year 10 you’d get an apprenticeship and go to TAFE. If you finished year 12 VET was the accepted pathway for over half school leavers. Since then, the school leaving age has gone up and a significant number of people now start Apprenticeships in their 20’s. Many young people who would have done an apprenticeship now aspire to a University pathway. Many of these with mixed results.

i-ex: What do you see as the most significant challenges and opportunities in the sector right now?

Ben:  If I was coming from a different country – given Australia’s strong history with Apprenticeships and trades – I’d expect to see bi-partisan support for how the Apprenticeship system should operate and how it should be funded. But this isn’t the case. Instead we have a complex framework with a variety of approaches and cost shifting between different levels of Government and employers. There’s no national conversation about how we make Apprenticeships a viable and attractive alternative for people.

What we see now is that despite Modern Awards, Apprentice wages are still relatively low but the value proposition for employers has changed. 

What we see now is that despite Modern Awards, Apprentice wages are still relatively low but the value proposition for employers has changed.  Apprentices tend to be a bit older often no longer living at home and require higher wages, whilst employers have to pay a greater proportion of the training cost than in the past.  The value proposition needs to be re-examined and we need to deliver on it in a future-focused way.

i-ex: What changes do you see in your sector in the next 5-10 years?  

Ben: As it stands, Apprenticeships are still falling quite dramatically – from an average of 2.5% of the workforce in 2013 to 2.0% of the workforce today. There’s also a high degree of policy uncertainty.  Governments tend to identify what they don’t like with the system, but there isn’t yet general agreement about how it should work. Over the next few years, my hope is that we can settle some of these policy arguments and focus on reinvesting and reinvigorating the sector.

i-ex: What advice would you give to someone looking to be successful in your sector? 

Ben: For people who work with Apprentices and support Apprenticeships, it’s important to look at things from both the Apprentice’s and Employer’s point of view.  Drop out rates are usually a result of the employment relationship breaking down for some reason.  This may be due to poor performance, but also things like unsupportive colleagues or the Apprentice not getting the training they need.  My advice is to listen carefully to what both parties are saying and try to figure out what’s really going on.

On the policy side there are real opportunities for bright minds to get involved in the sector and make a difference.  It’s an excellent time for people with new ideas and a future focus to get involved and bring fresh thinking to the table.

On the policy side there are real opportunities for bright minds to get involved in the sector and make a difference. 

i-ex: What is the best piece of advice you’ve ever received?  

Ben: The best advice came from my first mentor, Hazel Smith, who was the Principal of the Community College.  She said “Your decisions must stand any scrutiny”. She encouraged me to think that when you’re making any decision, imagine that the people who will be affected are looking over one shoulder, and their lawyers are looking over the other. The advice is to be ethical, considerate and transparent and try to examine your decisions and actions from all sides.

i-ex: How would you describe your leadership style or philosophy? 

Ben: My leadership has been learnt on the job and has been modelled over time by both good, and bad, managers.  I’d describe myself as empathetic and an enabler – I believe in people and their capabilities and always try to be there to help if they encounter problems.  I think it’s really important to stick by people when they’re going through tough life events and cut people a bit of slack.  If you do this you’re supporting the people you work with in a way that’s compassionate and ultimately, means you get the best out of them.  That said, I don’t tolerate people who abuse this trust!

I think it’s really important to stick by people when they’re going through tough life events and cut people a bit of slack.

i-ex: Who do you admire as a leader, and why? 

Ben: I’m very impressed by Jacinda Ardern (Prime Minister of New Zealand).  She puts compassion and empathy at the forefront of her thinking and approach and is carving out a different way of solving the some of the big challenges we face today.  I also can’t help but admire Greta Thunberg (16-year-old Swedish environmental activist) for the clarity of voice that she’s bringing to responding to the climate emergency.  As a young person, she’s taken on a huge leadership responsibility, just by telling the truth. In retrospect, I also admire Barack Obama for not using Twitter as his primary communication tool!

i-ex: What books are on your bedside table?

Ben: I’m currently reading Dark Emu by Bruce Pascoe.  As an academic, Pascoe has gone back to the diaries of early colonists to understand what Aboriginal life and economy really looked like when the British first arrived.  It’s very well researched and I’ve found it enormously instructive about how the process of colonisation dismissed Aboriginal culture and history.  Early colonists actually recorded well developed housing and agricultural practices in Aboriginal societies, but this information has been expunged from our collective understanding.  Dark Emu is an excellent read and I highly recommend it.

i-ex: and finally..what’s the quirkiest page or group that you follow on social media?

Ben:  I actually have an Instagram page based around my tedious hobby of cleaning dirty irons in hotel rooms!  It has a small but dedicated following. It bucks the trend of only presenting highlights on social media by documenting the tedium of travelling and staying in hotels. I refer to my hobby as Iron Maiden.

Post Author: Michelle Thomas-Kerr